Question about poison

[mainstreamclark]

I'd like some help interpreting the rules regarding totems and poison counters.

Now I'm at work, so the Wizards of the Coast website is blocked; however, this version of the oracle--retrieved from http://www.ebbemunk.dk/magic/index.html-- states the following:

120. Counters
120.1
A counter is a marker placed on an object or player that modifies its characteristics and/or interacts with a rule, ability, or effect. Counters are not objects and have no characteristics. Notably, a counter is not a token, and a token is not a counter. Counters with the same name or description are interchangeable.

Here’s what it says about totems

702.86 Totem Armor
702.86a
Totem armor is a static ability that appears on some Auras. "Totem armor" means "If enchanted permanent would be destroyed, instead remove all damage marked on it and destroy this Aura.

While a marker is not damage, it is marking a creature and can destroy it. Does that mean the totem could be destroyed instead of the creature? Therein removing the poison counters?

[mainstreamclark]

[/size][/font]

(2010-09-27 21:57 PM)mainstreamclark Wrote:   ...regarding totems and poison counters...While a marker is not damage, it is marking a creature and can destroy it. Does that mean the totem could be destroyed instead of the creature? Therein removing the poison counters?

Allow me to clarify: I am talking about the new Infect mechanic from Scars of Mirrodin, not the poison counters to players, and -1/-1 counters to creatures. How do these -1/-1 counters interact with Totem Armors?

[Disturbedone0777]

A creature that has a 0 toughness is destoryed and placed into the graveyard reguardless of what it has on it, including enchantments and industrictable creatures unless the enchantment would bring the toughness above 0.

So for example a 1/1 creature has a totem armor that grants +1/+1 so it's effectively 2/2. It recieves a wither counter (aka posion in mirodin). Now it is a 1/1 again. if it recieves another wither counter it would become a 0/0. That would cause it to instantly die, but not as a result of damage, but because it's toughness was reduced to zero. Totem Armors only die in exchange for damage, not in exchange for counter effects.

[ezio]

i'm assuming with regards to planeswalkers vs poison counters you would just remove a loyalty counter if a planeswalker got damaged with something that has infect

[mainstreamclark]

(2010-09-27 23:49 PM)Disturbedone0777 Wrote:  A creature that has a 0 toughness is destoryed and placed into the graveyard reguardless of what it has on it, including enchantments and industrictable creatures unless the enchantment would bring the toughness above 0.

So for example a 1/1 creature has a totem armor that grants +1/+1 so it's effectively 2/2. It recieves a wither counter (aka posion in mirodin). Now it is a 1/1 again. if it recieves another wither counter it would become a 0/0. That would cause it to instantly die, but not as a result of damage, but because it's toughness was reduced to zero. Totem Armors only die in exchange for damage, not in exchange for counter effects.

Thanks for your feedback! I'm a new player who was given a crash course at the Scars pre-release. This is how I see it, if the sets were college level courses, the Core set is Magic101: scars would be Magic350. XD Thanks again!

[ezio]

(2010-09-29 21:03 PM)mainstreamclark Wrote:  Thanks for your feedback! I'm a new player who was given a crash course at the Scars pre-release. This is how I see it, if the sets were college level courses, the Core set is Magic101: scars would be Magic350. XD Thanks again!

we are all new at some point bud some aspects are easier to pick up than others tho but yes you are quite right about your definition f magic as college courses ^_^

[mainstreamclark]

Here's another question: would Leyline of Sanctity prevent poison counters?
"You can't be the target of spells or abilities your opponent's control." Does that include poison counters?

[ezio]

i'm not too sure on that either brown coat or disturbed may know the answer to that

i'd say probibly not as its not an ability of an opponent as its from a creature

[AppleIIGuy]

No infect is not a tap ability or a targeted ability.
But if you had a poison counter and a opponent proliferated he could not target you to proliferate another poison counter. But he could target creatures you own with -1/-1 counters.

[ezio]

thanx for helping to clear that one up appleIIguy

[browncoat]

(2010-09-30 06:15 AM)AppleIIGuy Wrote:  No infect is not a tap ability or a targeted ability.
But if you had a poison counter and a opponent proliferated he could not target you to proliferate another poison counter. But he could target creatures you own with -1/-1 counters.

The first part of this is true: infect is not targeted it is simple how the creature deals damage so is not stopped by leyline of sanctity. Proliferate though is also not targeted as you choose any number of permanents and players (note the lack of the word target) so you can proliferate shrouded creatures and players that have counters.

[mainstreamclark]

Thank you to everyone who contributed. Poison is definitely a formidable strategy. I wonder if they'll bring about something in the next set, like a "Poison armor," to counteract infect.

[AppleIIGuy]

You mean like absorb?

Quote: * 702.61. Absorb
o 702.61a Absorb is a static ability. “Absorb N” means “If a source would deal damage to this creature, prevent N of that damage.”
o 702.61b Each absorb ability can prevent only N damage from any one source at any one time. It will apply separately to damage from other sources, or to damage dealt by the same source at a different time.
o 702.61c If an object has multiple instances of absorb, each applies separately.

[browncoat]

(2010-10-01 21:42 PM)AppleIIGuy Wrote:  You mean like absorb?

Quote: * 702.61. Absorb
o 702.61a Absorb is a static ability. “Absorb N” means “If a source would deal damage to this creature, prevent N of that damage.”
o 702.61b Each absorb ability can prevent only N damage from any one source at any one time. It will apply separately to damage from other sources, or to damage dealt by the same source at a different time.
o 702.61c If an object has multiple instances of absorb, each applies separately.

Phyrexia and slivers on Mirrodon, it does not get cooler than that. That would probably create a rift in the space-awesome continuum. That said it would also probably make Scars the most popular/despised block ever.

[AppleIIGuy]

lol I love slivers that is why my EDH deck is slivers...